Tuesday, July 11, 2006

Remember Pot to Kettle?

Back on June 21, 2006 Mike Luckovich of the Atlanta Journal Constitution posted a cartoon named Pot to Kettle, seen here as originally posted. As you can see from the link in the title to this post his cartoon drew massive outrage at his blog, as well as several other sites, and on the afternoon of the 22nd the name of the cartoon was changed to mask the truly despicable connotation of the name. The cartoon was bad enough on it's own, but the title told the true story of the meaning. Shortly after the name was changed Mike issued this response/excuse. In it you will see the mention of two soldiers that Luckovich at least acknowledges were treated unimaginably. The "bad timing" excuse touched off another round of outrage, discussed on his blog and here.


This is what Mike Luckovich and the Atlanta Journal-Constitution were comparing our government and our military to in Pot to Kettle and these are the soldiers that Mike thinks just threw off the timing of his cartoon. This site has the details and at the bottom of the post some disgusting and graphic pictures that will show what our enemy is really like and what despicable people like Luckovich think about our military.

You will be able to turn back without seeing the pictures if you choose. The Jawa report has placed them far down the page with a warning of when to stop scrolling. I am purposely not naming the soldiers on this post to cut down on the number of blog searches that might bring the families to content they don't want to see.

Hat tip: Gulf Coast Pundit

Our first discussions were here before the AJC had opened Mike's blog for comments.

Cartoonist Joel Samuelson may have best summed up my feelings here.

that was disturbing and to think that ml would use soldiers to make his stupid ass view about politics. is that the best he can do in his fight against president bush. if he wants to attack bush, he has that right in this country, because by the way of the soldiers that he is demeaning. it is almost sad that ml has gotten this much attention over this... what is that old saying - any publicity is good publicity. it is a very sad day when people like ml win awards for having no class or decency.

That's an interesting theory about the publicity, but I think it cuts both ways. In the past ml has been exposed enough to the awards committees. To the general public he is seen by whatever niche group finds each days drawing appealing and the rest ignore it.

By pointing out how completely over the top he is, he'll get more publicity but he'll also be seen for what he truly is.

Obviously a low traffic blog like this one isn't going to do it, but the beauty of the internet is that one tiny voice can be amplified very quickly. That can have it's own drawbacks too I guess.

In an odd way, luckovichs own blog may ultimately be the voice that brings him down because as you well know there are a few people at his site that are relentless in pointing out his true agenda.

very good point my friend, thanks! i really have a hard time understanding how liberal thinkers can actually live with what useless thoughts that rattle around in their head. i hope ml will be shown for what he is - unamerican
Powerline posted pictures of the two soldiers after they were done with them.

Sick stuff. War is hell.

I think these are something people need to see. Especially people that compare us to them.
Well, you can Google Iraq war images and see gruesome pictures of Iraqi children blown up by our bombs.

It cuts both ways. War is hell.

There is a huge difference so I'm not buying your moral equivalence here.

They fight hidden among women and children and often create the frightful images themselves. We have lost many soldiers lives for the simple reason that we don't indiscriminately bomb and shoot.

They dismember our soldiers bodies and parade them through the streets, where they think they can get away with it, to intimidate the populace. They do it on film to try to make us surrender and leave. That's the lesson of Somalia that we can't allow John Murtha to do to us again. It's pretty easy to google Bin Laden's words on why the US is a paper tiger too.

I would agree that death isn't pretty, but there is absolutely no comparison between us and them.
They are a brutal bunch. Our culture is very different from theirs.

Reminds me of the Vietcong leaving soldiers like that for the others to see.

"Don't mean nothing", they would say after seeing them.
RW: I'm assuming you have linked to a video. I can't watch it. I know what they're capable of. Words are enough for me.

Luckovich lives in a cartoon world. For him scribbled images are all he's got. Unfortunately for him, his careless scribblings brought angry words and rightfully so. No apology? Sanctimonious illiterate.

I never got a response from Angela Tucker. I wonder why. I may have left her speechless, or maybe there were way too many to answer.

I'm not sure the video is directly on the page I linked or if you have to link to another page. The page I've linked is text with still pictures at the very bottom of the page.

You should write back to Angela Tuck and ask why you didn't get a response. I would love to know whether they say it was because of the volume of complaints or if they try to blame bloggers for inciting a letter writing campaign.
JoeWilson or getalife..whatever the
h3ll you call yourself now.
War Is hell, and it's ugly, dirty and smells like overripe garbage. But where have you ever seen documented American military have dismembered and drug bodies through public streets?
Or stood on a public bridge and took pictures of the "prize", a decapitated head? The fact that you would even vaguely compare terrorism with our military is more than shameful.
I'm tired of the relativity people
use to say one thing is just like another. There is real evil and real good. One thing about it, the devil is sure liking the denial put up that he doesn't exist. Makes him just that much stronger. '
dim sum

May I call you dim sum?

You should take a look at this blog starting here.

It's possible that Honu is legit, but more than likely it's one of the libs that has changed names to try to pull a censorship deal. I think they are on the verge of losing it, but posting is closed so only a few that know how to get around it will be on.

I think I'll do a follow up on this in a few days.
RW? It's me, Honu. No, I'm not one of the libs that have changed names. I meant every word of my original comment to you today. This is truly the first time I've blogged on Mike's website . . .those photos and the video were more than I could handle and I just had to say something. And yes, I've been lurking for a very long time. . .truth be told, I left my house, took a long drive, then came back and wrote the email to you. I really thought about what I wanted to say and hoped I wouldn't be confused with other bloggers who rant just to see their words in print. I'm sorry, but I did find Midori's post funny -- as I have fallen out laughing at some of yours. Doesn't mean I agree with either one of you -- everytime I read you, or her or that person who goes by @@ -- sometimes I just laugh out loud. I regret that this took away from my original passion. It was sincere. You're right, I don't know how to answer on Mike's site now -- it seems to close at 7:00p -- at least on my computer. The person that called me a freakin' liar really deserves an answer -- don't know what I lied about, and I would truly like to ask him/her. But I can't get on the site until tomorrow. N-GA needn't worry - nothing has scared me away.

Anyways, just wanted you to know

You are very nice and open-minded to give Baby Honu the benefit of the doubt. Something about his snarky tone immediately led me to conclude that he is FOS.

It's possible that I am wrong.
ml's new "tune" is up and it shows how one sided his mind works. How he can demean the president's handling of N. Korea, by bush saying Ok don't cross this line, and not have applied that same thought to the UN's handling of Iraq simply baffles this old punk. He's a punk but not like me.

The pictures are horrible but not surprising, period.

Liberal relativity? The theory of relativity states that mass warps space, thereby drawing smaller masses into it. Who wil be the greater mass, freedom and representative government, or allah's law?

Wouldn't this have been a better place to make the original complaint then?

After all your beef is supposedly with this site and you must already know about all the name changing and nic-jacking that goes on over there.

I'm pretty sure that you can freely confront whoever called you a freakin' liar right here as well. This is not as nasty a place as ml's, but you are free to debate and make your points. Just don't get overly sensitive on the return.
Buy Danish,

I really do like the name Baby Honu better, especially with the visual you provided.

Thanks I'll go put it up at "after dark."

Just from your description I guess we will have exactly the same battles over there tomorrow.

Looks like we cross-posted. You sound sincere, but I'm still not convinced.

The lie would be that you were sitting on the fence until RW threw you over.
Read the comments on the link you posted. Too bad I couldn't leave
one. Honu is like people who will 1:
call you friend if they control you.
2: call you friend if the only friend in your personal life.
Maybe instead of seeing the results of barbarism in todays "modern" world and being reminded of the danger we all live with whether we acknowledge it or not, through posted photos, this kind of person would rather see it in first person.
dim sum
dim sum,

Well said and I think you just said it to Honu right here. I'll post it over there for the rest of the clowns to see if you like.

They only think they can shut off commenting!!

Isn't Baby Honu cute!

I hate to be so suspicious, but as "the person" who called him a freaking liar, if he really "lurks" as often as he claims, he would know who that "person" is, wouldn'tcha think? Unless he coincidentally began lurking the week I began my vacation.

Maybe he ...(do we know if he's a he? how do you tell with turtles?)... didn't make the connection between "Buy Danish" and "Danish in Vacationland."

I guess that was a really difficult transition for he/she to follow.

No wonder the whole Pot to Kettle analogy went over his head.
Anonymous, dim sum whatever your name is, I did not compare anything.


Welcome to the blog.
RW -- forgive my internet/blog ignorance and you are absolutely right. I should have posted my complaint here but it never occured to me. Since I clicked the link from Mike's blog, I went back and answered there. I humbly apologize. I am just now discovering how to talk to other folks on-line, and I don't really understand how this site knew I was Honu, but now it does (it says so at the bottom of this leave your comment form). You're right, I shouldn't have aired it in a public forum, but now I have and have to live with that.

Hi Danish - I was really impressed that you knew that Honu was Hawaiian for turtle! and I really was sincere when asking about your vacation -- I see your posts all the time, and remembered you said last week you were on vacation. You, too, make me laugh out loud sometimes.

Fair question - one I wrestle with every day. My nephew recently returned from Iraq, and I was still on the fence about do I support this war or don't I (he does). His stories are nothing any of you need to hear (just like I didn't need to see those photos). Suffice to say his experience was horrible. But he's a Marine, and Semper Fi. I proudly fly the flag, that was used at his hometown's homecoming ceremony, in my yard.

Even today, I was still on the fence when RW "threw me over". Don't think I can convey what looking at those photos did to me, and I pictured Rory lying there instead of those soldiers, as I'm sure anyone with a loved one in the war would do after seeing them. So you ask, why was Rory spared and these gentlemen weren't? And did he see this and is there any sense to this, etc., etc. So yes, that pushed me over.

Rory asked one thing -- that I don't take my yellow ribbons down until all his friends come home. I haven't and I won't, but I don't know that I can give this cause the support it needs.

RW -- I should have listened and never logged onto Jawa. But then again (and don't kill me) you should never have posted the link. We're both wrong, maybe?

love, baby honu
One more thing, Danish -- I did know that you called me a freakin' liar -- I just didn't know why and failed to mention you by name on my first post to RW. Wow, so many more have come in since I first and secondly posted that my head is spinning. I'll get better, I promise and yes, it's VERY difficult to determine if a turtle is male or female.

I sincerely hope you mean that the computer remembers you after you registered as Honu.

Tell your nephew thank you for me. I also had a nephew return from Iraq, but not as recently. He was their during the time Saddam was captured and gets disgusted by what we hear from the media here. Every so often he checks with his buddies to make sure that most of the press accounts are bs and he always comes away amazed at how different the stories are and how nothing good ever seems to be reported.

We will have to agree to disagree about it being wrong for me to have this link. Comparing our soldiers to these brutal killers is not something to be trifled with, nor is not understanding the brutality we face.

Just so there is no confusion, when you said you wrote me an email did you mean that first post at the AJC?
The truth is a swift and terrible
sword. Truth is not always pretty,
sweet and filled with love. Truth is raw, hurtful and filled with sorrow at times. But the truth will set you free, whereas lies told boldly or implied entrap you in an existance that is not real.
I guess I was blessed in a perverse sort of way, in that my father a WWII veteran told us kids about the war in all its "glory" of the body bags, drunken parties, firefights
and the rounding up prisoners of war. His reasoning was to make sure
we never assumed that because the armed conflict has ceased temporarily that it meant the war was over.
As long as there is good and evil the fight will go on.
As to you judging RW wrong in linking to (not publishing) the photos of our dead soldiers, he has the right to decide what goes on his virtual real estate.
Here's praying your nephew stays safe, that he and all of his friends come home safely.
Here's to (hand salute) the taking down of the yellow ribbons.
dim sum
The mad professor has returned with a message for several of us. I sent a response which should be up momentarily.
RW - Yes, I meant the email (post) to Mike's blog at AJC -- sorry, don't have the terminology down yet. I'm not sure what I did when I answered my first post here -- perhaps I clicked login and publish? I really don't remember doing that. But I blog on other AJC websites (okay, one and it's the American Idol blog - yikes!) and it always remembers me -- maybe it knew me because I linked from there to here? Anyway, I now have saved your http address in my favorites so I can by-pass the newspaper.

I know in my heart you are right, Anonymous, it is RWs right to publish that link, just as it is my right to rail (complain bitterly) against it. The ribbons are faded yellow, tattered and wind-torn. I sure hope I can physically take them down, before they simply blow away. But the flag is still glorious in all it's red, white and blue. I will treasure that forever.

I think I know why it came up with your name. This is a shared server system, so if you had registered to comment on some other blogspot blog it will remember you at any of them.
Baby Honu,

Sorry I was so testy with you. I hate to tell you, but you kinda deserved it. I guess you missed "The Shouter" aka RFV pretending to be an Independent who would have voted Republican, but...

First there was your "on the fence" comment, followed with an anti-administration comment, followed with a cheer to Midori. I wasn't the only one who doubted your intentions.

If you had just told the story of your nephew in the first place you would have received a warm reception.

BTW, I have not looked at those photos, but if I did, it would not make me want to leave Iraq - it would make me all the more determined to stay.

Thank Rory for his service for me. I don't have any yellow ribbons on my trees or mailbox, but my heart is filled with them.

Peace through strength,

Thanks, Danish -- you and I are not always going to see eye to eye. But one thing I do know -- your love for your country cannot be questioned, and I will by all means tell Rory you said thank you. I will even tell him how I met you and RW (he'll be shocked!)

And make no mistake about it -- I'll sit here and read Mike's blog every day, vote yes or no on whether or not I Like Mike and cheer/jeer you, RW, N-GA, Midori, @@, gadem, getalife, Andy, the professor, et al, but will only answer when someone has the nerve to knock me off my fence again (RW). I'll continue to lurk here, too, in RWs world -- much more civil.

And one last time, I really DO hope you're having a good vacation. . .dang, we get so few moments alone these days that each one away from work life should be cherished.

love, baby honu
Baby Honu,

American Idol, huh? Okay, I love AI, but you'll never find me blogging about it! J/K.

Maybe you shouldn't use the term "lurk". "Observe" might be a better word. There are a lot of lurking stalkers at MLs and it's really kind of creepy.

Thanks for the vacation wishes - I always have a great time, even on rainy days like today. I'm in a beautiful place in a beautiful country - what could be better than that?

You said you post at the AI blog and aren't real computer savvy so I thought you might want to know something about that blog.

The screen names you choose over there are in blue type and if you hover your cursor over the name you will see your email address. It's like that at any AJC site that has your name in blue, so you really don't want to use your real email address. It's not like that here unless you choose to put an email in your profile.

The AJC sites will accept anything so you could use something like poster@honu.com it will take anything with the proper format and will keep somebody from taking offense at something you write and giving out your email. I doubt that blog is very confrontational, but you never know.
Hi RW -- did I forget to mention that I'm the world's only living brain donor?

Seriously, I don't even know where to begin, without appearing really stupid, which I am not. I honestly never noticed the blue names on AI's site vs black names on Mike's site. Never clicked on one because I didn't know you could. Long story short -- this explains something very bad that happened to me in April on the "innocent" AI blog --

When I posted my first comment ever on AI, it asked for my name and email address -- so I gave it (yes, my personal/business email). I didn't know I didn't have to.

There was a person over there terrorizing everyone who blogged - and yes, blogging under others' names. Well, I made a few comments, he got a hold of my personal email and you can guess the rest. Mr. Ho, who writes the TV/Radio articles, had his IT department track this person down and he was banned from the blog (he did a lot worse to others that trusted him - I got off easy). I NEVER knew how that person got my email address, but started suspecting that the AJC gave it to him, which really pissed me off. And now, you solved a big mystery for me.

I actually was just there, clicked on a blue address and voila! Up comes my Outlook Message screen to that person. . .very scary and how stupid am I? That's how that clown got my real address!

So now I'm Honu, but I DID give my MSN IM address yesterday (instead of my Cox address) to Mike's website when I posted my first EVER diatribe at 5:11p or so. Again, the screen asked for a valid address, so I complied.

Okay, I'm going back over to Mike's -- I had a deja vu and could swear I saw my yesterday's posts on there again today? Didn't stop to read -- wanted to answer you first.

love, baby honu

You did see your posts. Since Midori thinks you are so thrilled with her and irritated with me she is pasting them again. This will probably go on for days even if you say something to her, so don't feel compelled to.

Even if she thought you didn't appreciate it she wouldn't care.

I'll drop a note to Randy Ho about that option on his blog. Each AJC blog starts that way and they all cause the same problem, but they never figure out that they should just turn that option off on all their blogs.
RW - I made some friends from the AI blog - we talk on private email, and one of them was so harrassed by this guy that I told her she needed to get the police involved (she gave him way to much info). I don't know whatever happened, and my last few emails to her have gone unanswered - probably nothing, but. . .

That would be great if Rodney would do that -- I'm curious, too, if that's an option, why hasn't his IT department told him that? It would solve everything there -- it gets really racist at times, for reasons I just can't begin to understand. Mike's blog really is much more civil (if you can believe that).
Hey getalife, as trite as this is, get-a-clue. Since all of my posts have been re-published again today (holy-moly!) and by Midori, I have to admit it does make me look guilty of blogging under someone else's name.

But no, I'm not Midori. I'm just baby honu, and if you re-read RWs blog from last night, my story is there. You know, instead of holding steady upright, I can lean to the left at any given moment, so you're not helping your cause when you mis-treat me by accusing me of hijacking a name.

your friend, baby (not Midori) honu
Baby Honu,

AI is less civil than ML's? Well I'll be darned!

Does Joe Roman (we call him JoRo) blog over there by any chance? He hates AI with a passion, and is a friend of "Goldie". JoRo's rant has something to do with how stupid and ignorant the American people are for voting for low brow entertainment while not voting for his favorite Democrat candidates.

I feel for you on the email situation. I was working (not blogging) with a group to restore summer vacation for our kids, and when we succeeded in making some progress I got deranged emails where I was called...SATAN for my efforts. Which reminds me - I'll have to ask Hillary what Jesus would say about summer vacations.

That experience taught me to be fairly circumspect about who I am, what my name is, where I live, et cetera on these blogs. I also keep my ears open for ticking packages in my snail mail box!
Buy Danish,

Write a letter to the editor with Ann Coulter's name used in a positive way sometime, if you want to see some interesting snail mail and hear some very colorful phone calls.

But we're the intolerant ones, I keep forgetting that part.

I worked with Rodney over at the AI blog and that problem with the emails is fixed.

The servers have been defaulted to turn this off, but any blog that was created before that has to be manually fixed.

If you ever see an AJC or Access Atlanta blog with the posters names in blue DO NOT use a real email address.
Hey RW -- left you a message on Mike's blog under the name American Idol (that was great - no one knew it was Honu!!!)

You really do rock - and I have to tell you, if you get some time later, go to Access Atlanta and check out Rodney's story on HBO & Kelly Clarkson. In comments, at 10:26a you will see "greg". See what he wrote - he is the one I have suspected all this time of being the predator on there -- he goes by DUKE, Jim J, mikedawg, etc. No one would believe me. And now he's decided to leave the blog on the very day he can no longer terrorize us? (go to 10:48a and he comes back on as DUKE).

I owe you a debt of gratitude for that one, and oh my, if greg ever found out that I initiated this there'd be hell to pay. Haven't heard from him since May, so I don't think I'm on his radar.

And yes, Danish, it gets THAT bad over there. Lately it's just fluff by the regulars, but during AI season it's ugly.

Again, thank you RW --

You're welcome I'll check that out.

Rodney didn't seem to have a clue that there had been problems over there. If you ever see a problem like that don't be shy about letting them or me know.

I think they do things quickly for me to get me to shut up :-)

At least Ann Coulter is a political lightning rod, but summer vacations?

Baby Honu,

I saw your AI post to RW and I knew it was you too!
Buy Danish,

If your summer vacation for kids was getting the kids out of the hands of government for my time then you have basically just committed one of the basic tenants of the Church of Liberalism so you're walking right into Ann Coulter territory.

She wrote a great book about it you know. I'm about halfway through it and every page makes me wonder why they didn't fake outrage over that page too.
Hey RW -- all liberals don't go to the Church of Liberalism. . .some attend the Church of Baptist. Plus, I never read anything by AC, but they let me in anyway :-)

Actually you are right! One of the biggest advocates of year round schooling is NAYRE and if you go to their website it is filled with Left wing agenda items. The last time I checked (a year ago?) it was all about Tom De Lay and Bob Ney - "like" that is really germane to the school calendars debate.

When I get back to GA I'll send you my hilarious email correspondence with the one particularly creepy guy who insisted that I was SATAN.

Speaking of email - I just sent you an important message. Well, "important" could be hyperbole...

But you sit on a fence sometimes, so maybe the Baptists are pulling you off from time to time.

Buy Danish,

If you keep beating up the teachers aide (I demoted OotMVoD) over at ml's I'm sure SATAN will be one of the milder things you will be called.
Hi Buy Danish: That's pretty brave answering Satan! I never responded to the creep who kept bothering me. Then it just stopped. And now it's stopped for good, thanks to RW.

RW -- perhaps those tugs ARE Baptist - unfortunately, I was transferred out of GA three years ago and nary a Baptist church in sight. I'm limited to watching Dr. Stanley when this NE state isn't pre-empting him for an infomercial.

I was thinking that ml's cartoon may have hit a little close to home for you today.

This is the main page. You should click on that and change your bookmark/favorites to come in on the most recent thing. A lot of us aren't going to think to scroll down here for comments.

This is where we post mike's cartoons to keep up conversations that might be going on when they close the blog
Yay -- just posted a note to you at ml afterdark and saved the home page in my faves.

Now I get it! As I said over there, thought I was gonna be stuck on July 11th forever - talk about non-forgiving (hahahahah)
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